The Ottawa Real Estate Podcast - November 21st 2023

[TRANSCRIPT]

:: 00:00

0:00:34 - (Matt Luloff): I'm the exact opposite of that. I think that the most power should be devolved to the lowest form of government, which would be the individual.

:: 00:42

0:00:52 - (Paul Stevenson): Hello and welcome back. This is the Ottawa Real Estate Podcast, where we talk about real estate, mortgages, whatever else we feel like talking about that week. My name is Paul Stevenson. I'm a mortgage agent, level two. You can check me out at paulstevenson CA. I'm joined as always, by my esteemed co hosts David Warren, owner and mortgage agent at Referral Mortgages, and Greg Campbell, realtor extraordinaire at the Campbell Merrick Group.

:: 01:24

0:01:27 - (David Warren): Great, great day.

:: 01:28

0:01:31 - (Greg Campbell): Just swell, just swell.

:: 01:35

0:01:44 - (Matt Luloff): He says, hey bro.

:: 01:45

0:01:58 - (Paul Stevenson): Yeah. For anyone listening. Last week we realized that AI uses the word delve in almost every construction of an article that it writes. So if you see the word delve in any article, very likely written by.

:: 02:09

0:02:13 - (Paul Stevenson): We're going to get do you delve? T shirts and sweaters and we will have it available as Merch in the coming weeks. Also, we should announce we're going to do now it's not finalized yet, but we're at the tail end of finalizing this December 18, which is a Monday. We're going to do our kind of final show of the year and we're going to do it live. We're going to rent out probably the Breather Studio or kind of a co working space for a couple of hours.

:: 02:37

0:02:53 - (Greg Campbell): It'll be a deep delve. It'll be a deep delve delve deep.

:: 02:56

0:03:06 - (Paul Stevenson): Everyone who's ever listened to the show.

:: 03:08

0:03:11 - (Paul Stevenson): So we'll give you some more deets as we get closer to the day. But that's kind of the plan. That's about a month away. So we're wrapping up November. Gentlemen, what are we seeing in the market? How are things shaking up?

:: 03:21

0:03:58 - (David Warren): And the sales, I think, will be down. There's only been four Octobers in the past three decades that have seen this that have seen this many listings. So I think November, it'll be in the last four decades. That's my prediction. We'll know that in a couple of weeks in December. That's crazy. That's the only stat that I have for you this week because I knew we had Matt on, and that was Matt's. More important than our stats. I do have some other information.

:: 04:28

0:04:30 - (David Warren): I thought this was very interesting. I was reading this this morning. One of our favorite people, Christian Freeland, announced a $1.2 billion investment in housing in Toronto, with a significant portion going to an 855 unit project on Front Street owned by Tricon Capital. Now, I didn't know this, but Tricon Capital is a company based they're in Toronto offices in the States as well. They buy up properties constantly.

:: 05:01

0:05:29 - (David Warren): But this is what is happening. So Tricon's coming in and just buying up properties like crazy in Canada now based on the idea that no one wants to buy a home and everyone.

:: 05:38

0:05:59 - (David Warren): That are outside and that's what it's about.

:: 06:01

0:06:25 - (Matt Luloff): Says.

:: 06:26

0:06:52 - (Paul Stevenson): That is very interesting. Yeah.

:: 06:54

0:07:08 - (Paul Stevenson): Anyways, that's it for me.

:: 07:10

0:07:11 - (Matt Luloff): Yeah.

:: 07:13

0:07:39 - (Paul Stevenson): Matt Luloff. Welcome.

:: 07:41

0:08:04 - (Matt Luloff): I think this is number three, but.

:: 08:06

0:08:10 - (Matt Luloff): Once a year I'll do my yearly since we launched.

:: 08:13

0:08:19 - (Paul Stevenson): So, Matt, I think the last time you're on we talked specifically about in Orleans, you were looking at or considering like the 50 minutes commute and kind of 50 minutes communities and so on. We've seen light rail, obviously have massive advancements since we last spoke. I think they were just starting like the Montreal Road station when you're on last. So obviously a lot has been done. So very broadly we can dig into some deeper things but what's new in Orleans as far as the real estate front and what sort of changes are you seeing there?

:: 08:46

0:09:19 - (Matt Luloff): And then the CIP provides a tax incentive to achieve that. Right? And so what a CIP does is you improve your property based on a list of criteria that the city is looking at. So let's say you've got I don't want to pick on a specific business, but think of the old Masconis or whatever, which is now like a tire changers on St. Joseph Boulevard, right? It's at the back of the property. There's a lot of concrete and asphalt in front. And so what the city is looking to do is to have businesses move to the street front, build some housing above it, like you see on a traditional main street.

:: 09:59

0:10:48 - (Matt Luloff): Now, unfortunately, the new mayor, when he came in, promised during the election to look at this because obviously some businesses that may be slightly controversial end up able to access this. And I think that probably the best example of that was during the last term in the Montreal Road CIP. A Porsche dealership was able to access this. Yes, that's what the land is used for. It's a local company that owns this franchise.

:: 11:19

0:11:47 - (Matt Luloff): And so I'm a bit disappointed with what they've come back with, but we can get into that later when we talk about what the city can be doing to ensure that we are meeting our housing goals. So that's a little bit disappointing. Although I'm pleased that we now have our secondary plan in place. So what's coming up? So we've had quite a few applications come in, some of them slightly more controversial than others, one of them being the redevelopment of the Orleans YMYWCA, big loss to our community to lose that space. And I fought really hard to get Palmer and, and the Capitol Courts Academy into that gym space. We don't have a whole lot of gym space that's not in schools in the you know, think of your local, your, your gyms like, has a, has a basketball court, but the other two in Orleans don't.

:: 12:41

0:12:50 - (Matt Luloff): And I mean, with the Pandemic, there was less access to those schools. So having these public spaces is really important. So I bemoan the loss of that space once they do redevelop, but it will be good to have more density near transit. So they're looking at a couple of quite tall towers. They're going to require an official plan amendment and a secondary plan amendment to get the heights that they're looking for.

:: 13:16

0:13:47 - (Matt Luloff): Why not move on so a younger family can move into the neighborhood? And she said, Well, Matt, there's no rentals, there's no rentals in Orleans. So I'd love to sell my home and I've built up this nest egg, but I can't stay in my community and I don't want to move to the you know, that's good. I'm glad that that's moving along. Another interesting project is one that's being proposed kind of just at the mouth entering, going down onto Petrie Island before the causeway.

:: 14:23

0:14:56 - (Matt Luloff): But they're looking there, and if they can get the city to work with them on transferring or being able to buy a chunk of land that's in a right of way that can actually meet the secondary plan goals, build some public realm there, they're looking at the possibility of a spa. The plans also show an amphitheater, like a privately owned public space for an amphitheater. So we can have concerts, maybe organized rhyme.

:: 15:23

0:15:30 - (David Warren): So many people watching have no idea what's happening right now or what that.

:: 15:34

0:15:37 - (Matt Luloff): Yeah, there we go. I'd get back together with them if you do. This sort of idea of having the developer build this public realm, I think saves the city a lot of money and adds a lot to the site.

:: 15:50

0:15:51 - (Matt Luloff): When somebody's looking to do that, the city needs to work with them and not say, okay, well, this piece of property is worth half a million dollars. And it's like, okay, well, to who? If I'm the only person that can develop it, you're not going to be able to put a row of townhomes there, so why don't I convey a piece of my property to you and then we kind of work this out. But no real property tends to fight with somebody who's looking to achieve their own goals.

:: 16:21

0:16:40 - (Greg Campbell): And Matt, with everything that you're working on and obviously like you alluded to, it can be kind of a tough slug a little bit of times across departments or within the council itself of what's stated as being the official plan. But then people have differing opinions of even what that should be. What are you seeing as far as in your area of Orleans cumland that's worked really well over the last year and then also what hasn't worked well? And what do you feel like you need that's lacking? Whether it be for the community, whether it be for housing, whether it be just in general, just kind of for your district, if you will.

:: 17:19

0:17:56 - (Matt Luloff): It's wonderful to say that we need to build more housing, which we do, frankly, but people need jobs to be able to pay for that housing as well. So cutting out industrial projects or cutting out simple employment projects is a bad idea. Cutting that out of a CIP is a bad idea. You got to have something for both, right? What else has worked really well? We've been using another kind of controversial tool that's provided to city via the province is cash in lieu of parkland. So rather than a parkland dedication in a development, they can pay the city.

:: 18:32

0:18:33 - (Matt Luloff): Basically it's like overlook the fact that I'm not building a park here and we'll give you money. But the good thing about that is that 50% essentially of that amount basically becomes discretionary or semidiscretionary spending for the councilor. So I've been able to update parks that in areas that are not high growth, so areas that will be ripe for infill development later on down the line but aren't quite there yet.

:: 19:02

0:19:36 - (Matt Luloff): We had parts of St. Joseph Boulevard being redone reduced to one lane. We had large swaths of Innis Road reduced to one lane because of construction. And we had the 174 reduced to one lane because of construction. So if you're not like a real lucky government worker that can work from home most days, how do we get in and out of our community? Right? We need to be able to do road maintenance without having to worry about people not having an option to get in and out of the community.

:: 20:06

0:20:55 - (Matt Luloff): So what we desperately need is to connect Brian Coburn Boulevard with the 417.

:: 21:01

0:21:02 - (Matt Luloff): Preferably at Hunt Club because then now you're starting to build there.

:: 21:07

0:21:12 - (Matt Luloff): Yeah. I mean, what's before Anderson?

:: 21:15

0:21:19 - (Matt Luloff): Could you could take all the back know Anderson Road? You could take all the back roads, ridge Road, and then kind of cut on to know you go down that hill through the NCC.

:: 21:30

0:21:33 - (Matt Luloff): Me too.

:: 21:34

0:21:34 - (Matt Luloff): But it would make a heck of.

:: 21:36

0:21:38 - (Matt Luloff): Yeah, it's like the worst secrets out, worst best kept secret. But I mean, you shouldn't have to dipsy doodle like that to get on the 417. And the single biggest barrier that we've had to making this happen is the National Capital Commission is the NCC. The city of Ottawa has offered them like, hectares of land to swap that's their role is to protect green space. And whatnot there's a hydro corridor there already that can be conveyed to the city for us to build this and we can do it in an ecologically responsible way. And in fact, the previous president of Friends of the Mayor Bleu, liked the route as well.

:: 22:24

0:23:02 - (David Warren): And it's funny that they have that bus oh my God, the parking ride at Brian Coburn and Navin Road and no one uses it. No buses come there. It's just like this empty parking lot. It's ridiculous. And it's built for exactly what you're talking about. And that neighborhood is developing like crazy. It's so prime for this whole Brian Coburn route downtown.

:: 23:27

0:23:31 - (Greg Campbell): I was going to say is there any movement with the like, is there anything that you think will actually be able to happen? Or are they feet in their sand like they usually are?

:: 23:41

0:24:24 - (Matt Luloff): Personally, this might be controversial to say, but I don't think that the National Capital Commission should be managing roadways whatsoever. Same thing with the Queen Elizabeth drive.

:: 24:35

0:24:35 - (Matt Luloff): If people were actually able to get to Lands down, it would be far more successful than it is. But when you block off the only way to get there other than Bank Street, where it's buses and cars and pedestrians and bikes in one lane, one way, trying to get in there, right?

:: 24:54

0:24:56 - (Greg Campbell): I love that questionnaire that they sent out. I filled it out online. They sent out a questionnaire of how often they're debating whether to leave it shut down for active use when there's a brand new $90 million bridge and newly designed or and newly constructed pathways along that same road. And I filled out and I was just like, this is like my answers were like, I would use this ten to twelve times a week, but I can't. So I'm stuck zigzagging or using bank and residential roads, and it just makes no sense. I was like, why did you spend all this money on the pathways right beside it, two pathways then to close the road as well? I don't know.

:: 25:37

0:25:41 - (Matt Luloff): Adding insult to injury, 30% delays for first responders in the gleeb because of it.

:: 25:49

0:25:51 - (Matt Luloff): Yeah, because there's a fire station right there near the Canal Ritz. They've got a dipsy Doodle through. And even if they do decide to take the QED when it's closed, that's dangerous. Right. Anyway, it's quite frustrating. Right? That's one of the single biggest impediments that we have. And then the know makes it even worse by reopening along with Minister Monaforte or ex Minister Monaforte starts opening up the debate about a new interprovincial crossing to the East End, which is also outrageous because all you're going to do is make it worse on the 174.

:: 26:35

0:26:57 - (David Warren): And what happens because where's that bridge going to be? Closer to Rockland, right? Well, they can't interfere with the ferry, but that's just insane.

:: 27:05

0:27:49 - (David Warren): I knew someone who was involved with that initial planning that never happened, and he quit because it didn't happen. And his comments to me were just like, you have no idea how long I've been working on this. I've been working on this for years. And the people involved are just horrible at getting anything done. And when it didn't happen, he quit.

:: 28:10

0:28:14 - (David Warren): Yeah, exactly.

:: 28:15

0:28:16 - (David Warren): And all that money was wasted just talking about it and with no result. It's terrible.

:: 28:21

0:28:52 - (Paul Stevenson): How do we fix this?

:: 28:53

0:29:21 - (Matt Luloff): Do you think somebody in Calgary cares about the Sir, Georgia Chen Parkway or the Aviation Parkway or the road infrastructure along the canal? No, they care about the canal and they care about the green space. But the people that sit on that board are not elected on any merit. They're government appointees. And frankly, I think that they feel entitled to act as if they are representative of Canadians, like somebody from Calgary or from Vancouver.

:: 29:50

0:30:33 - (Matt Luloff): And then you look at the numbers that we take because we monitor the traffic on it, and then you look at the numbers that the NCC takes and they're completely different. They tell a completely different story on top of that. And frankly, to be fair to them, I think they're set up to fail in that manner because they're not elected, because they're all appointees, and because I find that it reflects the government of the day. So it becomes more ideological than it needs to.

:: 31:05

0:31:37 - (Matt Luloff): We tried to go there for lunch the day of the army run. Well, first of all, there's the army run, so there's no parking anywhere downtown. But even if you wanted to take public transit to get there, it's almost impossible. If you want to go with your kids and whatnot, you have to find a place to cross over. There's no way to drive there. So basically it's a nice little lake pool for the terribly underprivileged people that live in Rockliffe Park.

:: 32:04

0:32:38 - (Matt Luloff): It's the bureaucracy that comes to you with, here are your options. It's like, okay, well, what about this option? Well, we didn't look at that option, so here's the options that are in front of you. And a lot of times it's that bureaucracy or that permanent government that kind of steers the ship, which I find frustrating.

:: 32:57

0:33:10 - (Matt Luloff): I think a lot of people intuit it, right? I think a lot of people out there right now are intuiting that things just aren't working. They're not working the way that they should. And they can point at me and they can say that, oh, you're a part of the problem, because they'll pick whatever their pet issue of the day is that costs money and say, oh, you voted in favor of the revitalization of Lands down or Lands down 2.0.

:: 33:38

0:34:03 - (Matt Luloff): The press box is condemned. Condemned. All of the suites are condemned. So people would say, oh, this is not end of life. You've got areas in your building that are condemned. You're end of life. Like, give me a break. Can you slap a coat of paint on? Sure. But can you make the bathrooms accessible for a reasonable cost? No. Can you expand the kitchen so that it can actually cater? No. So I kind of scoff at that a little.

:: 34:28

0:35:09 - (Matt Luloff): Would it be the one that I pick? Probably not. But what it's going to take is a concerted effort at reform. And this is why my frustration bubbles up. And I look to other avenues, obviously one that you alluded to at the beginning, Paul, to try and push for this kind of reform. So how many people are out there that deal with it every single day? Every single person that you see stuck in traffic in Orleans trying to make it downtown every day, I think intuits that there's a problem that we really need to work on.

:: 35:48

0:36:07 - (David Warren): And what's the timeline on the completion of the LRT to trim?

:: 36:13

0:36:55 - (David Warren): Yeah, it's just straight.

:: 36:56

0:37:09 - (Greg Campbell): Is that east end length that you're saying that testing is likely to start sooner rather than later is the plan for that? If it's finished before the west of opening up that east end like as soon as it's ready testing is done done properly unlike the last time and ready to go that they will open that up?

:: 37:27

0:37:28 - (Matt Luloff): I can guarantee you there won't be the same sort of political pressure or bureaucratic pressure to get that open this time around. I just don't see it happening. Following Justice Horgan's report and the lessons learned from stage one, I don't think you're going to see that sort of rush. I think that they're going to get it right. But yes, because there's no interaction with the western portion, you can kind of open that up and we're in good shape there, so, yes, we will be earlier than the rest.

:: 37:56

0:38:30 - (Matt Luloff): Right. And we can talk about that if you want.

:: 38:32

0:39:09 - (Paul Stevenson): For us as the general public who want to see change and know that change is needed, what can we do to accelerate that? And how can we hold our MPs and or counselors like yourself, like, how can we hold you more accountable?

:: 39:23

0:40:07 - (Matt Luloff): I'm the exact opposite of that. I think that the most power should be devolved to the lowest form of government, which would be the individual right. I truly believe that people should be trusted to make their own decisions and on aggregate we move in the right direction. So talking people used to say for polite dinner conversation, avoid what? Politics, sex and religion. Don't avoid politics, talk to people. I mean, my views on things have changed even over the last five years, over the last ten years, especially because of those conversations.

:: 40:45

0:41:13 - (Matt Luloff): And so you begin to challenge yourself a little bit. And that's something that I did during the pandemic. No, 30 hours a week of attending events. So what are you going to do with yourself to maintain productivity? You spend 2 hours or 3 hours answering the emails that came in from the day before or the night before and then you start I did things like this, like where I did a podcast where I brought city officials on and talked to them about plans and tried to keep people informed.

:: 41:41

0:42:19 - (Matt Luloff): And so what's the best way to do this? Get informed on the issues, build your own opinion of it, and engage people in conversation, like we're doing now. Right? Like, chat with your neighbors, chat with your friends, chat with your family. Maybe some of them are more knowledgeable in other areas than you. So you learn.

:: 42:39

0:42:41 - (Matt Luloff): And I think what I bemoan the most is kind of the retreat from that public sphere. In the 1960s, people were very interested in politics and what's going on. 1970s, too 1980s, it starts to drop off a little bit. That decline continues through the into the think that people either feel disengaged from the process, and so they don't try. Well, I'll tell you a secret. The only way to feel less disengaged is to get engaged.

:: 43:18

0:43:36 - (Paul Stevenson): When we were kids, politics were something that were maybe talked about at adult parties, our parents would be chatting or whatever, but nobody really cared. Like, if your friend or family member was a conservative or liberal, nobody actually cared. I think over COVID again, because of everything that we saw, it was very divisive. Like, everyone was kind of set in their ways. Nobody was having those conversations, and if they were, they already had their opinion made, and they were approaching it with visceral. Like, they weren't actually having an open mind. It was like, this is my opinion, and you're an idiot if you don't agree with me.

:: 44:05

0:44:34 - (Matt Luloff): There's no humility either. There's no humility. I will freely admit, if I've been wrong or if I'm in the middle of a conversation, somebody makes a really good point, and it's like, I really hadn't looked at it that way. That really makes a lot of sense, and your opinion on something evolves a little bit, right? And we also rush to judgment. Like somebody says, oh, you're a liberal or you're a conservative or you're a socialist or a social Democrat or whatever flavor they want to be that month. See now I'm doing it and being facetious.

:: 45:05

0:45:38 - (Matt Luloff): Strike up a conversation with somebody you've never met. I think Bourdain used to say that right. And also get the cream sauce. You should do that too. But I mean strike up a conversation with somebody you think you never would ever talk to and I guarantee you you're going to learn something and have.

:: 45:53

0:45:55 - (Matt Luloff): Yes, way more in common than you think. Absolutely.

:: 46:00

0:46:01 - (Greg Campbell): I think that's what a lot of people forget is that you have more in common than you actually think and kind of dismiss kind of on that surface level of what somebody's, to your point, ideology or thought around. Something, and they kind of dismiss everything and anything that comes out of their mouth, as opposed to engage in that conversation where they realize that, oh, yeah, you know what? Service level this topic we don't agree on. And let's figure out why and kind of challenge each other. But then realizing that there is that deep down such similarities and people I think to Paul's point, I think over the last few years that's gone to the wayside and people have forgotten about that and need to get back to that. And I think kind of it goes back know some of the topics like we were talking about NTC and stuff like that, where they're willing to have that conversation about change and what's needed and not having that egotistical viewpoint.

:: 46:52

0:47:40 - (Greg Campbell): How do you see and I know this isn't we're kind of on the topic on the local level but on the federal and we're talking about NCC and how the federal level can influence that or help that change? How do you foresee know for where your role possibly could be if things work out of moving to that federal level?

:: 47:59

0:48:50 - (Matt Luloff): But I don't think people should be punished for what they believe or what they think. Right? And so I worked on this as the chair of the honorable public library, and we brought in the most permissive and liberal, in the small l sense, intellectual freedom policy. So we don't like, ban books or burn books. Right. If it's out there, it should be in the library and readily available to people. So you can do the work that we've been talking about.

:: 49:16

0:49:46 - (Matt Luloff): You own yourself, you own your property. And your voice and your brain is your property. And so I think that fundamental respect for private property is paramount and it needs to be almost above all else. And then so when I look at the political landscape in Canada, I think we've demonstrated that the two other parties don't care much for private property rights. So what are you left with and what does that vision look like? And that's what I was attracted to, is that respect for the individual while compassionately caring for everyone and providing everyone with an equal opportunity, that's important because a lot of the problems that we face in society today are taken care of. When you respect each and every person as an individual, regardless of what they believe, regardless of where they come from, regardless of who they decide to take home with them, regardless of their family makeup, these are individuals. These are people just like you, and we should respect each other.

:: 50:56

0:51:34 - (Matt Luloff): There are fast timelines for site plan review and Op amendment that were imposed by the province, but now new applications aren't deemed complete until staff are satisfied with the submission. So the clock doesn't even start until staff say, okay, your submission is complete I don't think is entirely fair. Staff need to be able to work with the applicant back and forth in good faith over the course of 90 days or 30 days to get the job done, but forcing everything to be done up front.

:: 52:05

0:52:27 - (Matt Luloff): Parkland dedication is now 10%. Regardless of the proximity to green space. That's unhelpful. You're not going to be able to build as many units if you're right beside a park. You have to build 10% of your property as a park. That just doesn't make sense. Even if you're right across from a park, do you think that any of the abutting properties near Millennium really need 10% of that space to be used as parkland? No. If you want to build more units, that's not a helpful policy.

:: 52:55

0:53:20 - (Paul Stevenson): Yeah, that wanted trim is absurd. The wrap ridiculous. Yeah. We've seen builders walk away. Like, there's been projects in Ottawa that specifically in Ontario specifically, that builders are actually walking away and know, we're not going to get involved right now because the cost to build is like it doesn't make sense. There's no profitability there for the builder. There's no incentive to build. Right.

:: 53:42

0:54:09 - (Matt Luloff): But a lot of the times these people are not rolling in money because they have to leverage the previous project and the success of the previous project for the next project. So it all gets rolled up. So it's not know the owners of uniform or whatever or Scrooge McDuck, you know what I mean? Like rolling around in money in a giant vault. It's like no, they take this massive risk to build to buy land.

:: 54:37

0:55:14 - (Matt Luloff): The parkland dedication that we talked about means less units extending timelines through a longer pre consultation because time is money. And what's with high inflation right now, inflation is eating into how much your money is actually worth because of profligate government spending, because of disruptions to supply chains during the pandemic. Is it all the federal government's fault? No. Did they make it worse? And amplify, you know, punitive changes to brownfield CIP. Now, if you want to redevelop a get, this is what's proposed. You'll only get the brownfield grant, which is smaller than it used to be.

:: 55:58

0:56:13 - (Paul Stevenson): And like you said, you know, what makes housing affordable is having more houses available. Yes, that's what makes houses more affordable.

:: 56:20

0:56:53 - (Matt Luloff): You guys talk about this all the time and all the time. And you collect more property taxes, especially on infill. Especially on infill. So if you build more homes, you collect more property taxes. Now there's a cost of servicing so growth to the urban boundary. It's a bit of a wash and in fact, maybe a bit of a detriment, but no one argues that we don't need to expand at least a little bit. But when it comes to infield development, that's like you want to incentivize that, right. Like in the downtown core, along transit corridors, you want to incentivize that.

:: 57:34

0:57:42 - (Paul Stevenson): I think it would be amazing to get to a point where we are happy to pay our taxes because we know the money is going to the right places that are helping the right people. There's a saying, a rising tide lifts all ships. That should be the sole goal of the government, is to properly spend our money. It feels like right now we have this financial planner and accountant that are working against us and we're just feeding the money to manage for on our behalf and it's just being mismanaged thrown away. Siphoned it's very frustrating.

:: 58:11

0:58:25 - (David Warren): No doubt.

:: 58:27

0:59:17 - (Matt Luloff): There's loads of city land right now, unused city land. Why not partner up? Do a proper process, but partner up with great not for profit developers like Multifaith Housing Initiative and others and get them to put together a plan, a rough sketch, something that's not going to cost them a bazillion dollars? What would you do with this if we were to give it to you and then pick the best one. And hand the land over for a dollar. That's a huge input cost.

:: 59:52

1:00:44 - (Paul Stevenson): That's awesome.

:: 00:46

1:00:48 - (Matt Luloff): I'm sorry if I'm being this.

:: 00:52

1:00:54 - (Greg Campbell): Yeah. I think the three of us, and I'm sure the people listening as well, really appreciate the honesty and candor and sincerity that you have. You're not the typical politician or bureaucrat that kind of just gives the positive answer, or kind of scripted answer, if you will, willing to challenge your own colleagues on a daily and then even philosophically as well. So I think it's a breath of fresh air. I know for at least us three, I would imagine.

:: 01:23

1:01:26 - (Matt Luloff): And I get it, not everyone's going to like me and not everyone's going to agree with me, but it's like, so what? Just be honest about how you feel about things and if somebody challenges you and they've got a good argument, maybe my opinion changes. Right? I'm open to hearing other people. I think more people should be open to hearing other people.

:: 01:44

1:01:51 - (David Warren): So what's next for you, man, after this? Where are you going next? Are you a mayor? Are you going to be a mayor?

:: 01:59

1:02:46 - (Matt Luloff): Look, I just want to do the best that I can for Orleans and for Canada. I always keep an open mind as to what can be next. But there's also some constants in my life. I'm vicious with my family time. My family means the world to me, and I want to spend as much time as I can with my daughters. I want to be there at night to put them to bed. I want to do story time. I want to do bath time. That's super important to me. And there's, like a class of politician that wasn't important to them or they were old enough that their kids had grown up so they can go and do stuff. I can't be everywhere all the time.

:: 03:21

1:03:48 - (Matt Luloff): But, I mean, I'll always be playing music, trying to revive my veteran X podcast because mental health is more important than ever post pandemic and yeah, like Dave and Run. I'm going to take a run to federal seat here because a lot of the problems that I feel know the frustrations that I feel, and don't get me wrong, the city bears responsibility, and us as a council bear responsibility for some of the frustrations that people are feeling in the East End. And I do my best to try and alleviate those as well.

:: 04:18

1:04:34 - (David Warren): You nailed it, man.

:: 04:35

1:04:41 - (David Warren): With a of course I agree with that.

:: 04:44

1:04:45 - (Paul Stevenson): Yeah.

:: 04:46

1:04:47 - (Paul Stevenson): 2044 1st announced here once the girls do what? Awesome.

:: 04:56

1:04:58 - (Paul Stevenson): For sharing your insights, your time, everything. I know your schedule is very busy, especially with the young ones. So thank you so much for joining us, for sharing your insights, and we'll definitely have you back in a year. We should have you back maybe every year.

:: 05:12

1:05:22 - (Matt Luloff): Like 15 with Lula Report. We're totally Joe Rogan. We're totally Joe Roganing this one, eh? We're just going into the night now.

:: 05:32

1:05:36 - (Matt Luloff): Oh, I think that there'll be a lot of people from the Opposition Research Bureau that'll take Tidbits.

:: 05:40

1:05:42 - (David Warren): There'll be reels all over the place, bud.

:: 05:45

1:05:46 - (Paul Stevenson): Matt said we'll grab only the nastiest sound bites.

:: 05:50

1:05:53 - (Paul Stevenson): That's awesome. Well, thanks, everyone, for tuning in. This will be released Tuesday morning. Every Tuesday, 10:00 A.m., we got a new episode for you. And yeah, we're going to title this one The Lula Report.

:: 06:03

1:06:05 - (Paul Stevenson): Check us out on socials. As we said, we got shorts coming out now on Instagram and TikTok and so on. So make sure to follow us on all our socials, check out the videos. And thanks, as always, for tuning in. Gentlemen, do we have time for some mood boosts quickly? Absolutely. Squeeze these in. All right, I got three. First one. Number one. Sorry, sir, we don't serve time travelers here. Time traveler walks into a bar.

:: 06:30

1:06:32 - (Paul Stevenson): Number two, I found stir fry in my bed this morning. I must have been sleepwalking again.

:: 06:40

1:06:41 - (David Warren): Oh, I'm LOLing here, Paul.

:: 06:44

1:06:53 - (Matt Luloff): Well done. Well done.

:: 06:55

1:07:06 - (Matt Luloff): Take care, guys.

:: 07:07

1:07:15 - (David Warren): Thanks for tuning in, everyone. We hope you enjoyed today's episode. Please remember to, like, share, comment, and subscribe because we'd really like that.